The most interesting blog I've read recently about building a new system was (the guy who wrote the Doom and Wolfenstein black books) Fabien Sanglard's:
Got into PC building about 2 years ago, when I realized Apple's only real plan for the pro desktop market was the iMac Pro [0] and were never going to make up with Nvidia.
Got a shockingly powerful machine for the price it cost me, still less than if I'd got an iMac Pro and dual GPUs for Octane Render and 2TB SSD.
What I'm really itching for is a high quality case, there seems to be a ton of premium options for SFF builds but close to zero in ATX or mATX my preferred factor[1]. I'm currently running in a Fractal Define Mini-C which does look ok but still a bit plasticy if I'm going to have a large box in my house I'd honestly by happy paying upwards of $500+ for a premium case if I liked the look of it and it was all quality and looked sophisticated.
Probably sounds crazy saying that to most PC builders but at the sort of size a PC is at it's almost a piece of furniture so I'd like it to look good.
[0]: It was clear the Mac Pro was dead at that point and todays Mac Pro was only a response to the markets response to the iMac Pro.
[1]: Only one I can name is the Cerberus https://www.sliger.com/products/cases/cerberus_x/ which looks great but has niche build requirements.
I found that putting the large case (standard μATX, for low noise) on a stand under the desk (carpet+dust considerations) with a small homemade wooden box for IO on top of the desk worked well. No reason to have the big box visible when you only interact with a percentage of it. Just like a power distribution board is in its own closet and you interact with it using power outlets, the desktop computer was away and I interacted with it using USB devices and the on button. The only reason to get near it is for maintenance.
The on button is just two copper wires that need to make contact in order to boot the computer. You can use any old button from a store or make one yourself, or use a wireless one if your computer is really far away. The USB hub's case can be removed, and if you use the motherboard's internal audio chip you can find ready to use AUX extending cables for nothing.
Of course if you don't want to make a custom IO box you can just use a regular USB hub and a remote.
Are you including the cost of the 27" 5k screen when comparing the value of the iMac Pro?
Or the ECC RAM? Or the insane I/O with four thunderbolt 3 ports?
I find that people often don't compare Macs spec for spec. They just pick and choose the specs that they care about which isn't a great comparison. However this also speaks to the freedom of PC building - you can pay for only what you need.
A Ryzen CPU will expose 20 PCI-e 4.0 lanes to external devices. That's almost 3x as much I/O as 3 Thunderbolt 3 ports. A Threadripper will expose up to 72! Sounds like a downgrade to user-selectable I/O to me, not really a selling point.
Check out the Meshify C, it’s basically yours but with a really cool design on the front panel. Other than that though, I agree with you that there isn’t much on the market that stands out in mATX and bigger. The Thelio seems like a great design but it’s not available as an empty case.
This was a great write-up, and a solid reference. I've been meaning to build an SFF max-powered PC for a while, just as a fun pet project.
> That said, if you spend all day encoding videos, or compiling big projects in source code, the more cores but less overall speed tradeoff might be the correct one. And AMD is a lot closer on IPC now than they were 2 years ago, as well.
These days the IPC gap has been basically closed [1], which is what the write-up says, but really worth calling out. This hasn't happened since the Athlon 64 days. On mobile, AMD's IPC absolutely savages Intel with the 4000-series.
Not only more cores, but up to 16M of L3 per core (on the EPYC 7F52), and a whole lot of memory bandwidth to make cache misses more bearable.
A lot of builders try to strike a balance between price and performance, but if you are OK with spending a lot of money on one box, you can have a LOT of power.
That's waaay more compute power than I'd be able to use (which is why the last time I built my own machine - not including adding memory/storage to a pre-built one - was in the late 90's). My main personal laptop is an aging Core i3 that was chosen because I needed a laptop and this one was the one that could be delivered in two days) and my server (from where I run VMs for testing) is a low-end Lenovo server that was being sold at an unreasonably low price at the time.
> On mobile, AMD's IPC absolutely savages Intel with the 4000-series.
I haven't found many machines built on those. It's a shame.
I care a lot more about making the computer quiet than I do about making it small. Those are competing objectives.
I'm currently using a fairly large case from Fractal that has a bunch of big, slow-spinning fans as its only moving parts. I'm sitting right next to it and can't hear it at all. (When I'm playing a game, I can hear the GPU fans.) My life would not be improved at all if it took up less space.
My preference is for a quiet space too. I moved my machine into the nearby laundry room and only have an HDMI & USB cable coming into the room. I'm lucky my house orientation allows for this. Next house I buy I'll try to replicate the 100% silence I now enjoy.
Anyone interested in small form-factor (SFF) builds should check out Optimum Tech on YouTube. He specialises in SFF builds and reviews, the style is chilled out, and the videos are nicely produced.
I long for the day I can build a Mini-ITX laptop. I think it's doable considering you don't go for a dedicated GPU, but alas... the documentation on that is not abundant and I do not have the necessary CAD knowledge yet.
I've got a very modest Ryzen 5 1400 build with 24GB memory and some inexpensive GPU's to support 4 monitors. Nothing expensive. I'm not a dev so I don't need to compile or anything, although I do wish my GPUs were better, but only when I need to encode video.
The biggest takeaway is that I have a case that is 15 years old or so. It probably came with a P4 in it back in the day. For my use, it is good enough. It's not pretty. But it doesn't need to be. It just holds parts in place, which it does just fine.
With my next build, which I hope to do from scratch (everything's been an upgrade for the longest time) I hope to spend a grand on a mild gaming level machine, and another few hundred for a single giant 4k monitor rather than the 4 monitors I currently have. Then I'll buy a new case.
There has either been some recent generalized loss of quality, or a move of high quality players into some other channels for PC cases.
I switched mine in 2011, because they were too beaten already, and today they are the component that give me second largest number of problems, just after power supply unities.
I'm curious- what problems does your case give you? For me, once the computer is built, I rarely touch the case. My USB ports are on the desktop with a 7 port powered hub, and other than dusting the computer whenever I think it needs it, I don't touch it. So I can't relate, hence my question.
The last one I switched (just last year) had a broken power button that was embedded inside the case that I couldn't replace it without breaking anything.
I've had a few fancy ones with design failures that weren't showstoppers on a new case, but once the plastic parts whore-off they wouldn't hold well (ok, they were still usable). I had a case that developed some conductive points on the main board support, and one that after a bit of dust accumulated there wasn't enough airflow anymore, and one with an embedded fun that broke in months. All of those were mid-range models, from different manufacturers that people were recommending on the internet.
Funny thing is that last time I brought one, I got for the cheapest no-name thing available (it breaks anyway...). It's a plain standard case, with a simple robust assembly, standard ventilation, normal buttons, and a old-way standard main board support. I have seen no issues at all.
My only computer right now is a DeskMini A300W (6 inches X 6 inches X 3 inches, 1.92 L) with an AMD Ryzen 5 2400G. It is fine for older/simple games like GTA 5 and Rocket League and also connects to my 4K TV with a long HDMI cable and works for watching movies and stuff.
For work I normally am just in an SSH session or maybe in Visual Studio Code for my Ocaml experiment.
I also did this years ago, it was my last upgrade and I regret not getting normal sized boards. I only have space for one pci-e card, so I can either choose to have a video card, or anything else I need (such as a capture card). Now I would also like the possibility to run two capture cards, but I can't even do that. These small form factor pc's aren't event that much smaller than an mATX build, so I don't really see the point anymore. If a manufacturer would start making smaller PSU's GPUs and more integrated cooling, then maybe. I don't think you should sacrifice so much versatility a PC has just for a little extra floor space.
I understand making small machines is fun, and I did it once myself. I regretted it every day I used that machine, though and have gone back to "normal" sized cases.
I ask as its interesting to me how much less stuff goes into a PC these days. When I built my first box around 2000, it had so many components inside:
Motherboard/CPU/RAM
Graphics Card
Sound Card
Network Card
TV Tuner Card
Floppy Drive
CD Burner drive
DVD Drive (this prob came after initial build
2 3.5" HDs
That second portion of the list is effectively gone now, integrated into the motherboard, and M2 drives are the size of ram sticks and don't take up any significant space. Coolers have gotten bigger, as have high end graphics cards, but PC cases seem to generally be about the same size, when they are holding much less.
A "normal" build for the last 10 years (and much longer) has been a Case/MB/CPU/Cooler/Ram/SSD/PSU/GPU(if required) affair.
The problem with SFF is airflow. If everything is crammed together you are going to have to pump it through with high pressure and small fans which means noise, lots of it, if you want to have a high performance rig.
If you don't need performance, just get an all-in-1 or remodel a laptop build into the back of your monitor.
Do it. I just did a budget build around a SilverStone SG13 case for my htpc, see the image of case size comparison in the article. This was to replace an old full tower Antec case that was unsightly at this point.
Not a big fan of the new trends in PC cases. The tend to lack extensiblity. Downsizing is part of it.
One think I like about homebuilt desktop PCs is not just raw power, but also the large amount of options regarding ports, drives and extension cards. In laptops there is potability to consider, not so much with desktops.
For example, my tower has 3 5.25" front facing bays used. One for DVD, one HDD rack, and a multi-card reader with USB3 ports. Plus front panel jack connectors for headphone and microphones, and extra USB. Inside is a 3.5" mechanical hard drive in addition to the SSD, and an extra USB3 controller (for the Oculus Rift, which is quite finicky). It doesn't fit in a downsized case, and even finding a case with more than 2 front-facing 5.25" drives is hard enough these days.
Do I use them all every day? Obviously not, I'm not sure I even opened the optical drive this year, and it is not a feature I want on my laptop. But if I need to read or burn a CD or DVD, I know I have a computer that is ready to do that.
For me, small form factor PC still have a place in the living room. To watch movies, surf the web, play games, etc... Kind of like a modern game console, but more open. But for my desktop, I like to have everything at hand, even if it costs a bit in terms of clean look and makes cable management tricky.
I recently build a Ryzen 3950X PC in Fractal Define 7. The case is huge and mostly empty space. No problem though - the case sits below my 2-meter wide standing desk, so it's not competing with anything.
I've got a Blu-ray burner, some PCI-e sound cards that I swap from time to time, and a large potential for future upgrades / add-ins.
That said, it is spectacular what amount of power you can fit in these small boxes these days - if you need to.
IMHO a large-enough selection of big towers is still around, internal upgrade space is fine, you can get front panel jacks etc, but they indeed have almost universally lost the 5.25" slots. The aim seems either to be a sleek front or space for the biggest possible radiator, with only 1-2 spaces for optical drives etc left as an option on some models.
Wish I had this around to read for inspiration a few months ago. I recently upgraded my PC, and for the first time in 20 years of owning desktop PCs, bought a prebuilt one specifically because of size and aesthetic concerns.
I wanted a top-of-the-line gaming rig that ran quietly and took up a minimal amount of desktop space for my home office/"battlestation" [1]. Maybe I gave up too quickly, and maybe I've gotten too old for this shit, but I couldn't find anything that fit the bill without spending a lot of time on custom watercooling setups. I wonder how loud Atwood's rig is here.
I went with a Corsair One i165 [2] and love it so far - runs whisper-quiet no matter what I'm doing, and is small enough to easily fit on the desk. We'll see in a couple of years if I'm kicking myself over lack of upgradeability, but I'd hope its specs last me a long time.
Side note: it's kinda hard to find nice-but-not-gaudy components these days, I feel. Not a big fan of the RGB craze as I get older (although 16-year-old-me would have loved it).
Typically one of the main arguments against pre-built machines are that you can build a similarly specced machine for less. But the time and effort it takes to do so may not be practical for every situation, so really you're paying more to have something up and running much faster and (ideally) without the headaches of troubleshooting hardware. Plus, I agree that a lot of the components one would buy to build a similar setup are covered in XTREME GAMER RGB aesthetics and is really unpleasant to me. It can be difficult to find a high performance laptop that doesn't look like this, especially if you need a nice GPU in it. I'm saying all of this because I don't think some hardcore build-a-PC people truly understand the business/general value of (good, not cheap) pre-built machines. When one needs a performant machine asap to work when, say, they're existing machine suddenly dies, they do not have the time to assemble a PC usually.
Why do you think that Corsair will be difficult to upgrade? Genuinely curious, maybe the size of the case will impose limitations? Looks like there's only two RAM slots (ITX board?) so that might also be an upgrade issue?
Corsair One comes with a custom AIO cooler for its GPU. For me, the most often upgraded component in a gaming PC is the GPU, since you need a new one every two generations in order to keep up with the latest games. If you are the type of person that likes to play games on high/ultra settings, you will probably regret not being able to upgrade the GPU in your otherwise excellent computer.
Yep, I'm assuming the heavily-engineered case is going to cause problems for just trying to plop in whatever I want - even if I can cram it in, I wouldn't want to introduce heat issues that they've designed around. Maybe towards the end of its life I'll crack it open and see how I can hack at it, though!
My pet peeve with computer form factors is depth. 40-50 cm depth was OK in times of CRT monitors, but with LCDs and disappearance of DVD drives, there is no reason to have significant depth.
Even with mATX SFFs it is still rare to have depth below 30 cm. mATX makes lower bound to about 26 cm, full-length GPUs are up to 32 cm, but there are still powerful GPUs with reasonable length.
I have all my TV-related equipment on a stereo rack. That includes a PC for home theater use. The PC doesn't fit, I had to add boards to both sides of the rack that extend out two inches so there'd be a place for the PC feet to rest.
If I ever end up replacing that PC it will definitely be one with a smaller depth, even if it takes some work to find one.
I get the appeal of building in an SFF case, but there's a catch: with micro-ATX or full ATX case, you're more likely to put it away somewhere like under the desk, since the power button and ports will be easily accessible from the top. However, with a small case, you will have to keep it on your desk, adding to the clutter.
I built a computer recently and went in the opposite direction. Since the major differentiator of desktop vs laptop is power, I put as much power into my computer as I possibly could :) I also built a custom loop in it, because it looks cool, keeps the PC quiet at all times and I always wanted to do that.
I'm glad he wrote about this. I haven't paid much attention to building PCs in the last decade.
With that said, I'm sticking with my full tower format. It's bigger and heavier by far, but it's easy to do maintenance on, and the cats can climb and jump on it without doing any damage.
I'm not a thermodynamics engineer, but one thing that strikes me as odd about all of these is that most of the fans are sitting parallel to the motherboard, and sandwiched between the board and the wall (which only has small holes).
Whereas the Apple way, since the PowerMac G5, has been to mount the fans perpendicular to the motherboard and daughterboards, and push air across them. That seems like it would be much more efficient, better for both cooling and noise.
Is there a reason these PC systems mount the fans that way? Is it not actually as inefficient as it seems? Is this a case of modular parts each needing their own built-in cooling, and not being able to look at the bigger picture?
I've always liked the look of small PCs but I feel like they probably wouldn't be great if you also want a quiet PC.
Personally I would like to mount my computer in a server rack that's not in the same room as the rest of the setup (so just route the monitor cables, a USB hub, and an ON/OFF button through the wall). That way you can use the computer without having to hear it.
If you want some inspiration for sff PCs then I can recommend the subreddit /r/sffpc [1].
I like the comparison of compute power volume density to consoles. I think it shows up as a win when you also consider that consoles turn into wind turbines under high load. You simply cannot quietly pull away hundreds of watts from a small area without big fans. 140 mm is just right for this amount of heat. With a clever layout, you don’t need a case much larger than you longest dimensions (set by mobo and GPU, mostly). It’s a fun challenge.
Build logs are less frequent now but I'm glad he wrote about this!
I recently rebuilt my rid (ncase M1) with a Ryzen chip and now want an excuse to use all that power. I think one of the biggest case size constraints are how massive high end GPUs are and whoever cracked 2080Ti type performance in a small single-fan chip will do wonders for the SFF community and portable computing in general
Man I'd forgotten how much time I used to spend scrolling through build logs 10-15 years ago. I loved watching the things people would come up with, particularly in the case modding world.
But ... why?
Unless you are going to tug it around a lot, what is the big deal with miniaturizing? There are lots of ways to "hide" a PC or make it blend in with office furniture. Just reducing the size of the box seems a bit of a pointless fad unless you are fine with laptop like performance, in which case ...
Kind of strange to refer to "laptop like performance" considering the parts he's using.
And why not? Aesthetics are very important for a lot of people. Unless you're doing some sort of watercooling or need multiple GPUs or other expansion cards or need to put it a bunch of HDDs there's no reason you can't go for a smaller form factor. Why should a mid or full-sized ATX case be the standard?
The problem is that high performance builds produce a lot of heat, and those tiny cases do not have enough space to let that be easily extracted with low RPM high diameter fans, so you are going to end up with a pretty box that is going to be pretty noisy, unless you stick to lower power consuming and thus lower heat producing laptop like parts.
Space, I suppose. And those of us w/ Mac or design backgrounds appreciate a smaller and more elegant computing... (not for everyone, I know.) There is a point in that most users who aren't using huge multicore or GPU workloads shouldn't have a giant box of fans occupying half the legroom under the desk, esp in smaller work environments. And yeah, they're missing out on high end capability but the form factor is more appropriate to the use-case
At the other extreme are those folks who work on the iPad exclusively, like the poster/blogger who just runs everything on the cloud using a SSH client.
Just finished building my new PC last week after running the old one into the ground over 6 years. In the 7 liter sized Dr. Zaber Sentry 2.0 case (basically the size and form factor of a gaming console) I easily fit a Ryzen 3700x and RTX 2070 with zero cooling issues and fans I can barely hear. Here's my takeaway:
- If you want a truly SFF PC (no, 20 liters is not small), you're going to have spend extra money and extra time on finding components that will fit. ITX options are very limited, SFX is somewhat pricey, and GPU form factors often don't adhere to the NVIDIA/AMD spec, so clearance-compatible cards are limited.
That said, I love the new form factor - it's got everything I need in a tiny package that I can put anywhere and is easily portable for cleaning or when I need to do some on-site video rendering and laptops just don't cut it.
But the problem with it, as well as /r/sffpc is that their top priority is a gaming PC, and they optimize for putting in a latest, most performing GPU.
I as a developer, don't need a discrete GPU for nothing more that to connect several (2, actually) screens to the pc.
That said, I haven't found a small case that doesn't optimize for "normal-size" GPUs (too big for non-gamers) and doesn't cost a fortune, yet.
I've used a high-end gigabyte brix at work running ubuntu - this is a laptop-class cpu, but with a fast ssd and 16GB of RAM, perfectly fine for development work -- and they're tiny and silent.
I've had two PCs with integrated GPU where the GPU failed. I ended up finding a cheap no-fan GPU card and installing them rather than replacing the whole motherboard. No idea why the onboard GPU would be unreliable.
I had a microATX case for about 5 years, and it wasn't great. I can't imagine building or using anything even smaller. I had to practically disassemble the whole thing if, for example, a fan started rattling, a SATA cable was loose, or I needed to reset the BIOS[0]. I got a much larger sound dampening case after that, and it's amazing. It's easy to work in and much quieter, and I don't mind the size because there's lots of room under the desk.
[0] I wasn't using a board that was high end (or recent) enough to have a back panel button for this.
Those who kinda like downsizing, but don't want to be limited to ITX and SFF parts
Heres Raijintek Thetis [0]. Takes full size ATX motherboards, GPUs, CPU coolers and power supplies. Dimensions 210×360×366 mm (27.7L), smaller than most mATX cases and rivaling some ITX.
I keep looking at it, trying to find an excuse to build a new system, but waiting for next gen Ryzen.
I used to have a big fascination with small form factor and power efficient PCs. Other than having Mac mini for a while, I didn't actually implement to much on homebuilt PC side, mostly due to cost. I've had a fairly small mATX case and used lower watt CPUs. For projects like HTPC, the tradeoffs made sense, but I don't have one of those any more and for my desktop, I'm back to a full size case and full powered components and large heat sink to go with it.
The last two PCs I built were smaller units, based on some older Coding Horror posts. The thing I've found is that even though the parts have gotten smaller, the cables haven't - they're just as long and thick as they've always been, which makes layout a lot harder. And the configuration is less convenient - the power supply covers 3/4 of the motherboard, so you have to remove it to do any useful work.
There's one thing I don't get: why would I optimize for size to begin with?
I live in a small studio apartment together with my gf, and I still am completely happy with a giant ATX case that sits under my desk. And if I would switch it for anything, it would be a bigger case, with more space to organize everything, not a smaller one.
People aren't always putting computers on or around their desk. It took a while to find a case that had the right fit in my old TV stand/entertainment center. Size was part of it, but so was shape. Anything in the shape of a cube or mini tower wouldn't fit. I needed a pizza box shape, but not one that was too wide or too deep.
Luckily, both my HTPC and entertainment centers are both due for upgrades, so at least now I can plan ahead.
What I've been personally and voluntary communicating over and over for couple weeks, is that the minimum volume achievable without exotic parts is _3.9L_ using "SGPC K39 ITX" case, which is one whole liter less than Intel Ghost Canyon NUC that measures almost 5L.
(It'll be dense as a lead block, and loud and hot though)
No it doesn’t. Yours is 1.92L without power, 2.24L with that 120W power brick.
And the difference against 3.9L is about as much as a GPU takes, so you’re just saying an ITX build with no GPU is weaker but smaller by what you just removed. A tautology.
While I'm used to a lifetime of blaring fans and the pale dim glow, I'm getting more interested in building quiet machines. Especially for things like media centres or NAS. It sucks to have a computer blaring while you're trying to watch a movie, or think in your living room.
I recently found out that my mini-ITX PC case (the EVGA Hadron) can actually support a larger motherboard with minimal modifications. That means more PCI-e slots, more RAM slots, more storage connectivity, and better I/O. It's making me excited about eventually building in the same case!
I kind of want a SFF as my next PC. For example the Enthoo Evolv Shift Air looks stunning and I could actually put it on my desk unlike my huge ATX case. I just don't know if it's worth paying more for less with the increased difficulty in building and upgrading it.
Seems like quite a few people built PCs because Apple's desktops have been atrophied, that definitely played a part for me, too :)
I've designed a water cooled mITX system with PCIe GPU that should've fitted into a 2DIN car radio slot, which is doable with a deep enough slot, a PCIe riser, and even a DC/DC power supply in the box. I never got around to actually building that due to life getting in the way, but the components ended up in a laser-cut acrylic cube crammed as small as can be. I have to say the laser-cut acrylic case works quite well, and is well within reach of anyone with a maker space close-by and basic CAD skills.
Have people switched back to using PCs for development, especially since they're staying at home with the covid-19 lockdown? Or is it still mostly a Mac market, despite having to fork over nearly three grand for an eight core workstation?
On the east coast, I'd say that most of the programmers I've worked with in IT departments for Finance, Health and Pharma companies are not using Macs - but in my office, a dedicated software consulting firm where the owner has tried to emulate Google - about 2/3 of us use Macs. Personally, I can use any of them to get my job done but right now I prefer a Linux with XFCE.
Interesting - from that if you combine the macOS and Linux users together they do make up the majority which may be why I thought they were an even larger percentage overall.
Though I bet if this survey was restricted to the bay area the percentage would be even higher.
You would be wrong to a surprising degree. Stores have been limiting the number of laptops, prebuilt desktops, and monitors people can buy at once, and makers like Dell and Lenovo saw a huge spike in shipments, so much that they have even raised prices. VARs are having a hard time keeping things in stock.
Not sure why you've been voted down so much, but as a home worker I certainly prefer my fairly beefy 4 year old desktop to a modern laptop - more memory, more cpu.
I guess the question is how long home working will remain, but talking to my team earlier, those of us who do work from home are set up with multiple monitors, decent ergonimics, and a decent work location. Those who go to the office are working in random locations and finding things far harder.
Fired up the desktop to do some Folding@Home and also to work with Unity while I continue to use my MacBookPro as my main work machine. Desktop is now stuck in a Windows 10 reboot loop after I foolishly allowed it to install updates.
I’m running the same PC since 2011, and doing done hefty EM simulations in it. I did expand it to 32 GB RAM recently just cause I was running out, and 32 is still insufficient.
I’m holding out until the new i9-10 are out. Unfortunately those are still stuck with max 64 GB RAM.
I'm assuming that EM simulations are massively parallel. Depending on your budget you should consider a threadripper or the new Intel HEDT for a budget option.
That’s the problem. They are not massively parallel. In fact, don’t use more than two cores efficiently. Therefore the i9 will perform better than Xeon due to higher clock speed with lower cores.
Also, this software uses Intel MPI libraries. A new i7 runs it 30% faster than a new Ryzen 7 with same clock speed. So Intel is tweaking their compiler for their processors.
See my other reply. Ryzen is 30% slower due to Intel compiler optimizations, and I need higher clock speed rather than cores. The new i9 with 5.1 GHz boost should work best.
Server platforms always had more RAM channels and hence 128GB+ options though? Last time I seriously considered purchasing some bragging rights few years back, retired 192GB Xeon jet engines were like $350 on eBay.
Also I wonder if 64GB limit is enforced or simply listed as max tested, there are 32GB non-ECC Unbuffered modules these days. That's 256GB populated on 8 slots.
Don’t know. I just read that 10 series is 64 GB max. I do know that Ryzen supports ECC and > 64 GB. Intel must want you to buy Xeon, when that is a poor choice for my application. I need clock speed, not massive cores.
http://fabiensanglard.net/the_beautiful_machine/index.html
He built a neat looking, entirely passively-cooled machine.
Discussed here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22501462