As a user, big Angular apps feel super slow and bloated.

Eg: Google Cloud console downloads like 20MB of resources.

Maybe the DX is good, but from an end user perspective, Angular is far from good.

> Google Cloud console downloads like 20MB of resources.

That's literally the biggest (publicly known) Angular app in existence, and the fact that it's slow doesn't have anything to do with Angular. E.g. FWD:Everyone pages load in well under half a second:

https://www.fwdeveryone.com/t/K3KKGbMyQbaCGDc-izuaow/venmo-f...

At this point the main things preventing it from being faster are the TTFB from CloudFront, and the fact that Bootstrap is used as a dependency.

> Eg: Google Cloud console downloads like 20MB of resources.

That must be a fairly large application. Consider they are pushing it internally, I have no idea how optimized that is.

When you consider this is cached, that means you only have to do that once until an update. Similar to any other software.

Look at what Electron apps do in terms of constant updates. This is similar, but it's a web page.

This is just on first page you load. As you navigate it loads a LOT more more stuff. I opened the console and it loaded like 20MB, then I navigated to another section and it loaded 15MB more.

And the problem is not only the bytes loaded but how clunky and slow it is in general.

The Electron argument doesn't make any sense as it includes two runtimes ffs.

I feel the same way about Angular. There some minor bugs that have had open issues for 5+ years and may well never get fixed, but by and large the day-to-day experience of writing and maintaining code is pretty great.

I just don't get the concept of people being like, I'm going to start a project that's likely going to take the ten years to become successful, but I'm not willing to spend the twenty hours to read the documentation so that it will be successful.

How is internationalization?

Last I asked, it was still a tire fire, even after more than a dozen versions and after a fully mature previous framework that was replaced :-(

Yea...Angular made a huge (and hardly documented) change to their internationalization library that forced us to migrate to a third-party one.

Basically, they now (as of Angular 12) force you to build a difference version of your app for each language you support, and either serve them up at different URLs or use cookies to serve up the right version to each user. The technical reasons make sense...your translations occur at build-time, rather than at run-time, but it's a pretty drastic change that occurred out of nowhere.

Not a fan.

Are you required to use Angular’s i18n support for some reason?

I use ttag (https://ttag.js.org) with React and like it. I don’t see any reason you couldn’t use it (or another library) with Angular.

Angular tries to be a 1 stop shop and internationalization is a major feature.

That doesn’t necessarily mean you have to use it.

Hardcoding a language variable into multiple builds?